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DistBB [PART II]

Name: sage 2013-09-06 2:55

DistBB [PART I] got deleted (probably because my Tor used the same exit node as the spammer). I bear no resentment towards Admin for I understand how utterly shitty this board's software is.

To Admin: could you please not use the ``delete all posts by IP'' button or at least hack up some way to protect posts against such deletion? If you don't mind, I understand you're quite busy.

Here is an update on the moderation system:

SPECIFICATION

A moderation post MUST have the string "!!mod-v1" as its `email' field, and it MUST be digitally signed (see the `pk-data' field). The `body' MUST match the following grammar:

body = tags-line "\n" moderation-line*
tags-line = tag-name (" " tag-name)*
tag-name = (any-character - "\0" - "\n" - " " - "," - "%" - "$" - "#")+
moderation-line = post-id (" " tag-index)+ "\n"
tag-index = nonnegative-integer

`post-id' MUST be the base64-encoded H160 of the post that is being tagged. Each `tag-index' is the zero-based index of the `tag-name' in `tag-line' that should be used to tag `post-id'.

The actual process for deciding whether to keep or delete a post is left up to the implementation.

EXAMPLE

Post "AAAA" is being tagged as "spam" and "worthless", post "BBBB" is being tagged as "spam" and "good", and post "CCCC" is being tagged as "worthless".

--begin post body
spam worthless good
AAAA 0 1
BBBB 0 2
CCCC 1
--end post body

SUGGESTED TAG NAMES

The purpose of the tags is to classify bad posts and annoyances to help people filter and control the content on their nodes. Dividing "A" and "A+" (good post) into "funny", "insightful" and so on is counterproductive since there is no reason why someone would want to configure their client to treat "funny" posts differently from "insightful" ones. The point of tags is also NOT to classify posts into topics.

Here are some suggested tag names along with their meanings:

"A+" : Post is very good, and should be kept at all costs.
"A" : Post is good.
"off" : Post is offtopic (in the case of strict thematic communities) or simply does not fit in, socially. This is very vague.
"spam" : The post is part of a disruptive flood where the contents of posts are computer-generated (e.g. the content is always the same or is chosen from a list).
"mspam" : The post is part of a disruptive flood where the contents of every post seems to be crafted manually by a human.
"prng" : While the post is not part of a computer or human driven flood, its contents are unreadable and it seems to have come out of "/dev/random".

IMPLEMENTATION SUGGESTIONS

Here follows an example of moderation system that can be used to decide posts' fates.

Using a system of rules, each post is assigned an integer rating. The decision of whether to keep or delete a post can be done as follows:

if the post's rating is nonnegative:
keep it
else:
if max(ratings of posts that reference it) >= abs(rating):
keep it
else:
delete it


In table 1 we can see an example of this policy.
highest rating of
referencing posts

\ 3 2 1 0 -1 -2 -3 n/a
\-------------------------
3 | k k k k k k k k
|
2 | k k k k k k k k
|
1 | k k k k k k k k
|
post rating 0 | k k k k k k k k
|
-1 | k k k D D D D D
|
-2 | k k D D D D D D
|
-3 | k D D D D D D D

Table 1. Deciding whether to keep or delete a post
according to its rating and the ratings of
the posts that reference it.


An example of system of rules used to determine posts' ratings could be the following. First see if any rule with the "force" modifier matches; if there is, then apply it directly. Otherwise, if any rule with positive rating matches, then the maximum matching rule wins; otherwise, the minimum matching rule wins. For example, if the rules that match a post have ratings {-3,-5,-6}, then the winning rating is -6. However, if the rules that match have ratings {1,2,-3,-5,-6}, then the winning rating is 2.

By default, posts are deleted after two weeks, in order to give the user a chance to review the deletion queue; "immediate" indicates that the posts should be deleted immediately.

--begin example
%trusted self bob ken
%acquaintances john uriel
%all %trusted-users %acquaintances
%annoying off mspam
%delete spam prng
%kill-list bertrand winston
%A A A+

pk self 10
tag self %A 10
tag self %delete -11,immediate,force
tag self %annoying -5,hide

pk %kill-list -5,immediate

pk %trusted 10

tag %trusted %A 5
tag %trusted %delete -5,immediate
tag %trusted %annoying -2,hide

tag %acquaintances %A 3
tag %acquaintances %delete -3
tag %acquaintances %annoying -1,hide

tag john,ken particular-annoyance -4,hide,immediate
tag %all some-annoyance-which-I-find-amusing 10
--end example

Name: Anonymous 2013-09-06 3:57

kool

Name: Anonymous 2013-09-06 8:03

>>1
I won't use it anymore, I only did before because I had little other choice while doing many things at once, in hopes of not having all the threads being corrupted because of the spam bullshit. I've been modifying the admin script to remedy these things.

As far as DistBB, are you still just on the specification stage, or have you written any code yet?

Name: polite bump 2013-09-06 8:27

>>3
As far as DistBB, are you still just on the specification stage, or have you written any code yet?
I wrote quite a bit of, if I dare say so, high-quality code. I obviously haven't finished the moderation and sync stuff since the specs were (are?) in flux. Among the things that are definitely done (with unit tests and everything) are the ed25519 (pk crypto library) interface, the latex sanitization and rendering interface (though it'll need a caching system), the texcode parser, and the post parser/validator (including signature verification). I haven't even started the web UI part since it's so dependent on the underlying model and there's no point in working on that until all the specs have stabilized.

How do you like the moderation specs? Is there anything I've missed?

Name: Anonymous 2013-09-06 8:42

The moderation spec seems fine, the only question is how well this algorithm works in practice.

Where's your repo, again? Or is it not public yet?

Name: Anonymous 2013-09-06 8:56

>>5
The moderation spec seems fine, the only question is how well this algorithm works in practice.
[i]If[/i] it's theoretically fine (which I don't know, which is part of the reason why I pasted it here for review), then the only thing that can go wrong in practice is that you misconfigure your modfilter (e.g. by trusting the wrong people).

Where's your repo, again? Or is it not public yet?
Not public yet. It'll very likely be up at https://ivasiwlrjq5dxk6b.onion/p/distbb once I feel complete enough. Or something. On the other hand, if I put it up now, it'll be easier for people to review things. Hm, I don't know, should I put it up?

Name: Anonymous 2013-09-06 9:44

>>6
Do as you like, I usually don't make anything I write public either until I feel it's complete / good enough, so I can understand if you would rather hold off.

What about the networking side of things? How complete is that? I could give you a hand on it if you wanted, before a testing release. I have a good amount of experience dealing with protocols and networks.

I can also mirror your repo on my server if you want.

Name: Anonymous 2013-09-06 11:51

>>7
Do as you like, I usually don't make anything I write public either until I feel it's complete / good enough, so I can understand if you would rather hold off.
I might put it up soon, at least the specs part.

What about the networking side of things? How complete is that? I could give you a hand on it if you wanted, before a testing release. I have a good amount of experience dealing with protocols and networks.
SSL and SOCKS5 (for Tor) support would be nice. I'll probably just use the python-socksipy and the default python library for ssl ( http://docs.python.org/2/library/ssl.html ). The sync protocol itself is very simple (I think I posted a draft of the specs in the tablecat thread, although I've made a few small fixes in the meantime).

I can also mirror your repo on my server if you want.
Thanks!

Name: Anonymous 2013-09-06 12:01

>>8
I'm definitely interested in the specs, even a draft. Having a reference document would make reviewing much easier.

Name: Anonymous 2013-09-06 13:06

>>6
Why are you not using github like a normal person?

Name: Anonymous 2013-09-06 13:11

>>10
Because I'm a rational person, and a rational cannot be normal.

Name: spamcop !er2pVUOpwU 2013-09-06 14:37

>>10
Do you enjoy privacy as we do? If so, you understand why many of us do not use github. We try to use any hosting sites that could not be used to identify us in real life, because were is the point in that than notoriety? Good software is ignorant on who built it, and what rewards or misfortunes it brings to the developer. Only code should speak for itself.

So far I have not found one git repository online does not request for some sort of identifying information:
https://git.wiki.kernel.org/index.php/GitHosting

Real ones, ask for a user, password, and a means to validate you are human. Then the repo is made.

Name: Anonymous 2013-09-06 15:11

The only thing github knows about me is a rarely used email address and the various wifi IPs I use to push code.

Name: Anonymous 2013-09-06 15:18

>>13
Does your email hosting provider have identifying information about you? If so, you have been compromised by many intelligent sources already.
If you host your own mail server, do you destroy information on the mail server that can be used to identify you? If not, you have been compromised already (plus email is an insecure channel of communication, always has been).

What's worse, is that even if you use no email, the recorded IP address have enough identifying information to note the areas you visit, and maybe the general area of your home. With that, any agent can look at public records of all the people in the area, and actually do an investigation. Your cell phone is usually your biggest security hole. I hope you use one that you paid in cash.

Name: Anonymous 2013-09-06 15:21

>>14
I wonder how easy it would be to match identities based solely on coding style.

Name: Anonymous 2013-09-06 15:39

>>15
Hard since the advent of the indent tool.

Name: Anonymous 2013-09-06 15:41

>>16
No, not that kind of coding style. I meant the logical way in which one programs, the tricks one uses, etc.

Name: Anonymous 2013-09-06 15:52

Name: Anonymous 2013-09-06 16:05

>>18
Can you make a repost (since the original post was in a thread that was deleted) regrading why tor sucks compared to freenet? I remember just one link regarding freenet exploits.

Name: Anonymous 2013-09-06 16:42

>>19
Ah certainly:
Why Tor sucks:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tor_%28network%29#Weaknesses
https://ritter.vg/p/AAM-defcon13.pdf
https://crypto.is/blog/mix_and_onion_networks
https://trac.torproject.org/projects/tor/query
Sample bust:
http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2012/03/stakeout-how-the-fbi-tracked-and-busted-a-chicago-anon/

I have it saved 'cause everyone keeps shouting tor this and tor that, and never analyze or practice threat models, since they have never working in the security industry. There are more on Gnunet sites/repos. These are just the tip of the ice.

Name: >>20 2013-09-06 16:49

Trying to recall if there was something else I missed than this:
https://gnunet.org/compare

Listening to this track lol while posting:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ESA63E6SzgE&list=RD02VF4MxYXZeLU
And I barely like touhou. Only 2 songs I keep, with remixes (night of nights and necrophantasia, I think i have only one version Owen was her)

Name: Anonymous 2013-09-06 17:52

>>20
If that ``anon'' wasn't a faggot clinging to a constant pseudonymous identity he would have probably gotten away with all of that. But no, he had to tell everyone what he did and lurk on IRC. Dipshit.

Name: Anonymous 2013-09-06 18:04

What we need is something between GNUnet and Tor; a high-latency high-bandwidth mix network.

Name: 20,21spamcop !er2pVUOpwU 2013-09-06 18:24

>>22
Who ano are you talking about? I have not been in rizon.net IRC in years.
If you are talking about this:
http://bbs.progrider.org/prog/read/1378488679/3
I explain my reasoning why, even the the usernames&keys will only be salted for admins/mods that last a short time, before they destroyed. IoW, it's a spam prevention mechanism, not a social network contract, nor identifying factor.

>>23
Something like SILC, OTR, and the beta secushare? p2p USENET nodes in a DHT for look ups. Why its not as popular, I guess the high knowledge entry point.

Name: Anonymous 2013-09-06 19:50

>>24
He's not talking about you. He was referencing the person in the article. Keep up.

Name: Anonymous 2013-09-06 20:05

>>25
Which one, this one?:
https://crypto.is/blog/mix_and_onion_networks
12 Apr 2013 16:52:00 EST by Tom Ritter

I am confused, I'll end it here.

Name: Anonymous 2013-09-06 20:11

>>26
What? Read the posts that people quote. He's talking about the anon in this article:

http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2012/03/stakeout-how-the-fbi-tracked-and-busted-a-chicago-anon/

See where it says stakeout-how-the-fbi-tracked-and-busted-a-chicago-anon?

Name: youtu.be/y6OApJlHJnA 2013-09-06 20:39

>>27
Ah thanks, I see. I thought it was about this conversation. If >>22 would have said something like this, I would have understood:

If [the] ``anon'' [in the article [from arstechnica]] wasn't a faggot clinging to a constant pseudonymous identity he would have probably gotten away with all of that [...]

Above is a giftpeace offering.

Name: Anonymous 2013-09-06 22:07

>>13
I have no permanent address or cell phone, and I randomize my wifi MAC address occasionally. To track me they'd have to monitor traffic patterns from numerous access points, but I don't stay in once place very long.

Name: Anonymous 2013-09-06 22:14

>>29
Scary.

Name: Anonymous 2013-09-06 22:18

>>29
So what are you up to?

Name: Anonymous 2013-09-06 22:19

>>29
Hello, Adrian.

Name: Anonymous 2013-09-07 0:12

>>29
And the email server? Everything else sounds impressive.

Name: Anonymous 2013-09-07 6:17

>>30-32
Fuck off, NSA.

Name: polite bump 2013-09-07 8:10

Name: another polite bump 2013-09-08 23:19

>>9
So any thoughts on the networking protocol or anything else?

Name: not distbb guy 2013-09-08 23:28

>>38
Telnet is a MUST. SSH in the future, http the obvious requirement.

I want to include an optional NNTP gateway as well, maybe IRC, and maybe have a gopher one too. Mmm, what about SIMPLE in the later future?

Notes:
P2P-SIP,P2PP

Name: Anonymous 2013-09-08 23:54

>>39
So the sync protocol looks okay?

Telnet is a MUST. SSH in the future, http the obvious requirement.
Telnet/SSH shouldn't be too hard to implement. I'm not sure about paging and all that stuff. Is there another telnet application whose behaviour you would like me to emulate?

I don't know how you can do the moderation/``tagging'' stuff using NNTP. An IRC gateway might work out; the latency is pretty big though.

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