Return Styles: Pseud0ch, Terminal, Valhalla, NES, Geocities, Blue Moon. Entire thread

A real BBS

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-05 6:17

Hello, /blog/. A thought just popped into my head and you all need to read about it.

What if someone (not me; I have better shit to do), set up a traditional BBS that required users to dial in, but had it used VoIP via google voice or some other free, mostly-anonymous service. Wouldn't that be neato. Further, full dialup internet access could be provided over the link. That would throw the NSA off for a bit maybe.

Well, off to bed.

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-05 6:24

no

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-05 7:30

>>1
That would throw the NSA off for a bit maybe.
despite what 'hackers' like jacob applebaum are paid to encourage to believe, the NSA is not your adversary. If it was the game would already be over.

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-05 7:36

>>1,3
no thank you

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-05 7:46

>>3
NSA shill pls go

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-05 7:53

>>3
NSA agent detected.
Either that or a super /pol/ their conspiracy theorist.

Who do you think pays Applebaum? The jews?

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-05 7:54

>>3
If it was the game would already be over.
The agency that focuses on shit like ``monitoring'' WoW and getting their ass kicked by low iq chinks and sandniggers.

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-05 10:15

>>1
STOP FAXING ME MESSAGES OVER SKYPE YOU FUCKING JERK

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-05 10:42

>>8
STOP HAXING ME ANUS OVER SKYPE YOU FUCKING JERK

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-05 10:48

>>9
STOP CHECKING >>11-KUNS DUBS OVER /prog/ YOU FUCKING JERK

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-05 12:01

http://rustbyexample.com/raii.html

Because Rust enforces the RAII discipline, whenever an object goes out of scope, its destructor is called and the resources owned by it are freed. This behavior shields against resource leak bugs.

You'll never have to manually free memory again or worry about memory leaks!

I don't get it - isn't that the same as Sepples? But in Sepples you have to worry about freeing memory and leaks a lot. Are they bullshitting me?

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-05 12:27

>>11
No.

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-05 12:34

>>11
Yes.

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-05 12:53

>>12,13
Thanks, /prog/, that was really helpful.

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-05 16:46

>>11
isn't that the same as Sepples?
Sepples doesn't have RAII consideration built into the whole type system. Rust has a dedicated pass for ownership checking. It's much more thorough and reliable than what can be done with C++ templates, and it gives you better error messages as well.

Of course, that's not the whole story about Rust. There are basic niceties that make your code more easily portable, and give the optimizer more information to work with while not being a confusing pain in the ass to learn and maintain by hand like with const and restrict. Once Rust hits 1.5 or so, it's gonna be regularly beating C and C++ for speed. The developers are very serious about improving their tools, and they know their shit.

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-05 17:50

>>15
You don't have to use const or restrict in C ether. The rest is just bullshitting.

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-05 18:42

>>16
I'm not sure why you would bother, it's not like they work.

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-05 19:15

>>16
Of course you don't have to use it. And you don't have to use the safety features of Rust, either: You can put all your code in a giant unsafe block, and laugh it off when your computer explodes.

Also, I think it's entirely possible that a Rust-style borrow checker could be integrated into a C or C++ compiler. The real advantage of Rust is that it implements this feature today in a few thousand lines of code, instead of ten years from now in a few million lines. The language semantics are friendlier to this kind of tooling than the semantics of C or C++.

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-06 11:39

>>15
I thought that Sepples destructors enforce RAII too.

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-06 13:14

https://github.com/str8c/nbbs

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-06 14:07

>>19
They do. >>15 doesn't know what the fuck he's talking about. Rust brings nothing to the table that isn't already in Sepples.

The only reason people are using Rust is they don't like the names of things in C++.

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-06 15:36

>>20
You lack a ACTUAL license.

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-06 19:39

>>22

You have ACTUAL dubs.

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-07 0:40

>>21
In C++ it's still possible to obtain a raw pointer to a managed object and allow it to escape without producing any warnings. The whole point of Rust is to have these things enforced by the compiler.

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-07 2:33

>>24
The compiler "enforces" them by telling you "NO DON'T GO THERE IT MIGHT NOT BE SAFE!!!!!!!!!!!!" and not compiling your program. That's the opposite of helpful.

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-07 2:54

>>25
Every person who has ever introduced a memory related bug thought they knew better, too. I would like to hang up that cluebat before I'm retired, thanks very much.

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-07 6:02

>>25,26
It depends on the ratio of false warnings to valuable warnings.

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-07 6:34

>>27
"false" warnings?

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-07 8:20

>>27-28
I just don't get this dismissive attitude toward static analysis that so many programmers have. So fucking what if you know about some invariants that the analyzer can't prove. If the machine can't figure it out, the next guy who touches your code probably won't either. The best, most maintainable code is that which is trivially correct.

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-07 8:34

I doubt it would work due to the compression that Skype uses.

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-07 9:01

>>28
Like gcc -Wextra I guess.

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-07 9:56

>>21
Sepples doesn't have pattern matching and heterogenous types.

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-07 15:51

>>31
-Wextra doesn't flag anything that a human reader might also find problematic.

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-07 15:56

>>29
The thing about static analysis is you don't need to make drastic changes in what language you're using just to implement it properly. That's why Rust and Haskell and so on are basically snake oil. They're trying to sell you the bathwater along with the baby.

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-07 16:19

>>34
If by "properly" you mean 48 lines of proofs for every line of actual code, then I'd rather take Rust and Haskell.

Besides, Haskell is a purely functional language and shouldn't be compared to Sepples.

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-07 16:20

>>34
The thing about static analysis is it looks like CompCert when you do it right and it looks like grep when you do it wrong. But going to CompCert is more drastic than Rust or Haskell because C can't express the the necessary relations. The fact is C, C++ and the like just aren't good at expressing correct code because they were never meant to be sound in the first place.

The weird thing is you'd rather write awkward C or whatever, fight with the static analyzer over false-positives, and have the optimizer fail to identify the invariants that a real type system would than write in a language that could be faster and safer without so much extra work.

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-07 22:49

fuck state-owned buggable phone cables, what about 3.14MHz AM broadcast packet radio?

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-07 23:44

>>37
Hardware (engineering) is harder than software (programming).

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-08 1:58

>>28
A warning about something that is actually perfectly safe.

>>29
If you are suggesting to only do what the machine can figure out, you are needlessly restricting yourself. If you want a human to understand it, document it. And just because a computer can verify doesn't mean a human can understand it.

>>35
What kinds of proofs? Human written or machine generated?

>>36
C is a practical language. What you describe is impractical, experimental, hypothetical grasps into empty air.

>>37
legal issues

>>38
Irrelevant

Name: Anonymous 2015-01-08 2:14

>>39
You must be one of those nutty retards that think a computer can become sentient.

And just because a computer can verify doesn't mean a human can understand it.
There is literally nothing preventing a human mind from understanding it.
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