Which touhou would you program with?

Discuss.

In fact, one of the Algol people said that Haskell is the modern Algol[5].

Contrast with obfuscated C which looks just like minified JS
https://www.cise.ufl.edu/~manuel/obfuscate/babble.hint

>>40
this is intentionally obfuscated, of course it's not readable. in general, haskell can be readable but I agree with you that the community is too focused on complex category theory bullshit that's not really relevant to actual programming.

>>29
C creators are mental midgets because they brought back the buffer overflow and other already solved problems[1], and made it impossible to port programs to capability-based computers, which really do work as well as the hype. This was like bringing back smallpox.

Mental Giants somehow lost all their market share to two C hackers with portable assembler.
C clearly had superior qualities

Lisp, Smalltalk, Self, and Ruby Mental Giants somehow lost all their market share to one browser hacker who made a scripting language in 10 days. JavaScript clearly had superior qualities.

we don't have Algol compilers shilled on every corner(but Cobol,Fortran,Ada,Lisp do).

The ideas of Algol 60, except for call by name, have been inherited by Pascal, PL/I, Ada, and Fortran 90, so there is not really any more use for Algol 60. There is no more Algol 68 because the people are into Haskell now. I learned about Algol because of my respect for Ada and other languages I like, and wanting to learn about where they came from, instead of being told that these C and UNIX hackers are God's gift to programming and everything their small minds don't understand is ``bloat''. The low quality of C is why some believe that everything else from the 1970s had to be bad too, and is not worth learning. Once you remove that mental block and free your mind, you will be able to understand the brilliance of these mental giants.

Algol lost badly to C, get over it.

You can build this kind of thing for any strongly typed language. Microsoft tried with Singularity, but that's software instead of hardware. C and C++ are the only languages that can't run on these systems. Buffer overflows would be gone forever, programming would be a lot easier, and the OS would be higher level. Maybe a cure for cancer would be a better analogy than eradicating smallpox.

[1] https://homes.cs.washington.edu/~levy/capabook/

Unfortunately, the one language Ten15 could not support was C, since C is not adequately typed, and this - in the era of C's rising dominance - was a big reason for Ten15's downfall. Ten15 was seen as being increasingly marginalized by everyone's desire to run C, and increasingly C++, programs. This is somewhat ironic given the recent proliferation and popularity of perl, python, ruby, Java, C#, etc, all of which would have mapped nicely onto Ten15.

http://www.mca-ltd.com/martin/Ten15/introduction.html

>>30
COBOL introduced character and string handling, records, and precisions to programming. The importance of strings and records in programming is obvious. If you know anything about Ada, you would know that the programmer, not the compiler writer, specifies the precision of data types. The Ada concept came from Pascal and PL/I but the overall idea originated in COBOL. This is what mental giants do. They see how you specify numbers in COBOL with decimals and how the compiler automatically scales them, and are able to envision a grander idea, fixed-point arithmetic.

>There is no more Algol 68 because the people are into Haskell now.
https://sourceforge.net/projects/algol68/

>>44

Lisp, Smalltalk, Self, and Ruby Mental Giants somehow lost all their market share to one browser hacker who made a scripting language in 10 days. JavaScript clearly had superior qualities.

dude what are you talking about? none of those other than javascript are web scripting languages
and netscape's javascript is definitely not the same as the one in use now.

>>43
If that is obfuscated here is "normal" haskell code:
https://github.com/xmonad/xmonad/blob/master/src/XMonad/ManageHook.hs

If most programmers are "mental midgets":
why would you shill Haskell everywhere and stuff monads,endofunctors and homomorphisms
It would make more sense to appeal with simpler abstractions like in >>39
map/filter/reduce than stuff category theory into everyone brain.
"mental midgets" btw built up the software stack haskell runs on:
the haskell runtime, compiler, OS, libc. From the academic ivory tower
their work is beneath juddling lambdas on the stacks
and far below monad tranforming wizards they deem themselves as. I

>>48

If most programmers are "mental midgets":
why would you shill Haskell everywhere and stuff monads,endofunctors and homomorphisms

They're shilled to appeal to non-mental midgets.

It would make more sense to appeal with simpler abstractions like in >>39

Only if you want to appeal to mental midgets.

>>49
Why are people trying to insert Haskell into JS?
http://jrsinclair.com/articles/2016/marvellously-mysterious-javascript-maybe-monad/
Into C
http://www.cs.utah.edu/~arichard/monad.html
Into Java
https://dzone.com/articles/whats-wrong-java-8-part-iv

>>45
The people who were pushing it are into Haskell, so there is no shilling anymore. They're shilling Haskell now, or maybe Ada if they're talking about systems languages.

Haskell can do everything Algol 68 can and much more. I think it would be good to have Algol compilers because people should choose languages that work for them instead of this monopoly where everyone is adding half-baked ideas to C and C++. I also think universities should teach COBOL because disrespectful shrunken heads want to replace it with Java because they don't understand the point of COBOL. They think Java is better because it has garbage collection and classes.

>>48
Haskell on hardware can work[1]. The Haskell library is shaped by UNIX, but the people of the past believed high-level languages should shape operating system and hardware design.

[1] https://github.com/tommythorn/Reduceron

Behold the benefits of Haskell:
function getUserBanner(banners, user) {
if ((user !== null)
&& (user.accountDetails !== undefined)
&& (user.accountDetails.address !== undefined)) {
return banners[user.accountDetails.address.province];
}
}

Dirty, imperative code is transformed into pure monads and functors.

var pipe = require('ramda').pipe;
var bannerEl = Maybe.of(document.querySelector('.banner > img'));
var applyBanner = curry(function(el, banner) { el.src = banner; return el; });
var curry = require('ramda').curry;

var applyBanner = curry(function(el, banner) {
el.src = banner;
return el;
});
var liftA2 = curry(function(fn, m1, m2) {
return m1.map(fn).ap(m2);
});


// customiseBanner :: Monad m => String -> m DOMElement
var customiseBanner = pipe(
Maybe.of,
map(R.path(['accountDetails', 'address', 'province'])),
liftA2(applyBanner, bannerEl)
);
customiseBanner(user);

>>52
Disgusting.

>>52-53
Everything based on C is disgusting.

>>54
https://github.com/ghc/ghc/search?l=c

>>50
because monads as a concept are pretty useful (and not that hard to understand when you learn by practice instead of focusing on formal definitions). as bad as Java's Optional<?> and stream API are, they're better than not having them.

on the other hand, I doubt that there will be any sort of push to implement homomorphic dependent multidimensional antidisestablishmentarian type abiogenesis in cyclical LGBT calculus categories.

>homomorphic dependent multidimensional antidisestablishmentarian type abiogenesis in cyclical LGBT calculus
Trivially this reduces to higher-order polymorphic lambda calculus operating on lexical monads

>>57
lets see these guys implement diff

Which 2hu would be able to implement diff?

>>59
all of them

>>60
Except maybe that one with the goofy hat.

I don't know about diff but Marisa was able to implement a first order logic prover https://github.com/MarisaKirisame/first_order_logic_prover

LOL
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I LITERALLY JUST

PEED

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JUST A LITTE THOUGH

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WHATA FUCK MAN xD i just fall of my chair cuz i couldnt and i CANT stop laugh xDXDXDXDXDDDDDDDDDDDDXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD OMGOSH DDDDDXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD DDDDDD LOOOOOOOOOLLLLL THIS IS A SHIT hgXDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDXDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD A BIG ONE XDDDDDDDD A GRAT ONE XXXXXXDDDD CONGRATS MAN XD

WHATA FUCK MAN xD i just fall of my chair cuz i couldnt and i CANT stop laugh

DDDDDXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD DDDDDD LOOOOOOOOOLLLLL

THIS IS A SHIT

XDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDXDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD

A BIG ONE

XDDDDDDDD

A GRAT ONE

XXXXXXDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD

>>52
That shows the importance of syntax in programming. With a bad syntax, shills (or idiots) can destroy a whole idea.

Github: It's like facebook with fizzbuzz.

>>65
fizzbook.

/prog/: it's like facebook with dubs

>>20

running on more advanced hardware like the iAPX 432

U MENA slow as fuck hardware

>>67
The UNIX head shrinkers create ``college-educated'' people who lost their desire to learn and their respect for mental giants who paved the way with better technology than we use today. These are the same brain-damaged idiots who say RISC-V is faster because it doesn't do overflow checking. These idiots were pooh-poohing memory-mapped files and virtual machines as ``bloat'', and now they use them all the time while pretending they never had a problem with them. If they were code monkeys, we would just laugh at their stupidity, but they are professors and other university faculty, teaching this to students.

The brilliant iAPX 432 was influenced by work at Carnegie-Mellon University[1] in the 1970s. What does Carnegie-Mellon teach now? They created the brain-damaged and non-standard C0 language[2] to teach ``Principles of Imperative Computation'' (read: C-specific quirks and flaws, with training wheels to make it more like Pascal) instead of standard well-designed languages like Ada, which incidentally was the language for which the iAPX 432 was created. This collapse in civilization is something out of Planet of the Apes.

and by a gift from Google for the development of CMU's introductory undergraduate courses.

Perhaps they want to create more C code monkeys to work on their monopoly Android system[3].

[1] https://homes.cs.washington.edu/~levy/capabook/Chapter9.pdf
[2] http://c0.typesafety.net/
[3] https://www.reuters.com/article/us-eu-google-antitrust-exclusive-idUSKBN19Q1RU

it doesn't do overflow checking

Wait, what? What the hell? Really? Why?

C code monkeys to work on their monopoly Android system[3]

That article wasn't about C, it was about bundling their 20 bazillion Java spy apps.

>>70
Java is a C-based language, thanks

>>71
Sure, but the real question here is do C code monkeys write Java.

>>72
Well since code monkeys care about careers, the answer is probably. The syntax and the fact it's C-based makes it easier too

>>73
How does C-based syntax make it easier, when it's badly designed brain-damaged crap? You keep assuming that these university students already know and like C instead of having it forced down their throats by these professors who say it's ``the standard'' and ``what code looks like.''

>>74
Most universities teaches both for CS

>>74

when it's badly designed brain-damaged crap?

That really doesn't matter. It's used to teach OOP concepts, which it does well.

>>76
It does not teach OOP concepts well at all. Java's brain-damaged crap ``OOP'' is why so many people think OOP is a problem. Eiffel teaches OOP concepts well, if you want to like OOP instead of hating it and thinking it's snake oil.

>>77
This. In real OOP languages, all types are objects.

>>78
In real functional languages, Ints are 31 bit and 1 bit reserved for garbage collection.

good thread